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I still haven't been on here much because I got sucked into Marvel Movie Universe by Thor and The Avengers. That and TV Tropes. The last one alone is quite the time drain. Combining the two has landed me with The Sorting Algorith of FaceHeel Turning and me figuring out where Loki fit on it. In other words, how likely was it that he'd turn traitor in Thor and how likely is he to be redeemed in some future movie? Oh, and potential spoilers ahoy under the cut.
On the likelihood of Face/Heel, Loki ends up as follows by my count:
Species = 1 - He's a god-like alien, although you can argue 2 because he's apparently actually a Frost Giant but that just means he looks like a pretty blue elf with red eyes when he's really cold. He definitely thinks of himself as 1, or at least prefers to.
Age = 5 - He may be nearly immortal but he looks like and is often treated as a young adult.
Role = 4 or 5 - Everyone except Thor seems to act like Loki's a freelancer (4) and Thor acts like Loki's his second/shadow/person he doesn't even have to ask to come with because of course he's coming with (5).
Aesthetics = 4 - He may be attractive, but he's still got the creepy pale-skinned brunet thing going on.
Motivation = a solid 3 - He qualifies as an Unfettered thanks to the Blue and Orange Morality of Moral Sociopathy. Or because he's an alien trickster god whose motives are rather unfathomable to mere mortals.
Characterization = 5 - While you could argue a 3 because he is surly and bitter, he comes across as alone even when surrounded by people, so Loners are Freaks it is.
Contentedness = 5 - The guy is one big ball of angst, angst, angst...
Morality of the Story = 4 - The hero of the story is a douche who gets a bit better and the villain makes you wish someone gave him hug before he decided to attempt genocide, so I'd say the morality is pretty firmly Grey and Gray, even if the ones behind it wish we'd view it as black & white.
Cynicism = 1 - It's a superhero story that isn't a deconstruction of superhero stories, so it's pretty damn idealistic.
Total = 33/9 or 3.7 on the high end (Thor's POV and pretty ice giant). 3 is Who Knows? but 0.7 puts him closer to Likely on the scale of turning traitor. The low end has him as 32/9 or 3.5, which is what most of the other characters would view him as. Honestly, the other characters view him as a traitor much earlier than Thor does, despite having the even less likely possibility from their POV.
As for Loki's redemption potential:
Species = 4 - He's a pretty human-like alien, even when he is blue.
Age = 4 - The whole near-immortal alien equivalent of young adult again.
Role = 1, 2, 4 or 5 - In Thor, Loki is technically both the Big Bad and an opportunist (1 and 2). In the Avengers, it looks like Loki's the Big Bad but by the end, it's pretty obvious he's the Dragon to Thanos (4), at best, with shades of Rival Turned Evil in regards to Thor (5), although perhaps it's more accurate to say Brother Turned Evil.
Aesthetics = 4 - Because Evil is Sexy
Motivation = 2, 3, or 4 - Quite frankly, the reason he's such a fascinating character is because you can make a solid argument for all three. The whole twist plot that culminates with ending the war with the Jotun/Ice Giants by trying to destroy Jotunheim definitely falls under "Unscrupulous with some kind of goal" (2). That he did it the way he did because it would prevent any Aesir from dying makes him a Well-Intentioned Extremist (4). That his motivation for doing it at all was because he wanted to prove to his father he was worthy of being loved just makes him a literal Woobie Destroyer of Worlds (3).
Characterization = 4 or 5, depending on the movie - in Thor, he's definitely a 5. He just learned his whole life up to that point was a lie, so he was definitely lost and confused and the deleted scenes suggest he was making it up as he went. By the end of the Avengers, he's graduated to a Graceful Loser (4).
Contentedness = 5 in Thor, 3 or 4 in the Avengers - Loki's pretty obviously all Angst, angst, angst in Thor. By the Avengers, he seems to have settled somewhere between Life is Hard and Neutral, albeit with the occasional glimpse of Doing Well.
Morality of the Story = 1, 3, or 4 - While the movie makers might claim to be black and white morality (2), the Avengers aren't really all that white on the morality scale. Natasha and Clint have blood on their hands, Bruce admitted to destroying Harlem (and that's not counting anything that happened in The Incredible Hulk), and neither Thor nor Tony Stark come across as particularly moral or anything. Steve Rogers is the closest they have to a righteous man and w/ his PTSD, he'd be the first to argue he's not. They cause damage, kill aliens, and put a metal gag on Loki in the end. W/out Steve's presence, I'd say it was definitely a Black & Gray morality (1). With Steve, it's probably closer to Grey & Gray (3), but with the whole thing with the gag, that's somewhat arguable. You can also make a pretty good argument for 4, aka The Good, the Bad, and the Evil. The Chitauri are obviously the Evil. They don't even bother talking before killing people and destroying things with their army. The Avengers would, ironically, be the Good. Which leaves Loki as the Bad. He's not as bad as the Chitauri. Yeah, he was helping them, but there's indications it wasn't entirely because he wanted to. The scene with him and the Other came across as rather abusive and violent on the Other's part for all that they didn't do much other than talk. Also, Loki's lack of involvement with the Chitauri army he's supposedly leading is somewhat telling. Heck, you can argue Loki was as brainwashed as Clint and Dr. Selvig - he does come across as a lot calmer after the head (and neck and back) injury. Of course if that's the case, we're right back into Black & Gray morality again...
Idealism = 5 - It's a superhero movie. It's pretty damn idealistic.
Total = High end puts him at 40/9 or 4.4 or Quite Probable. Low end puts him at 28/9 or 3.1 or Who Knows? No wonder some many fanfics have him being redeemed in some way.
On the likelihood of Face/Heel, Loki ends up as follows by my count:
Species = 1 - He's a god-like alien, although you can argue 2 because he's apparently actually a Frost Giant but that just means he looks like a pretty blue elf with red eyes when he's really cold. He definitely thinks of himself as 1, or at least prefers to.
Age = 5 - He may be nearly immortal but he looks like and is often treated as a young adult.
Role = 4 or 5 - Everyone except Thor seems to act like Loki's a freelancer (4) and Thor acts like Loki's his second/shadow/person he doesn't even have to ask to come with because of course he's coming with (5).
Aesthetics = 4 - He may be attractive, but he's still got the creepy pale-skinned brunet thing going on.
Motivation = a solid 3 - He qualifies as an Unfettered thanks to the Blue and Orange Morality of Moral Sociopathy. Or because he's an alien trickster god whose motives are rather unfathomable to mere mortals.
Characterization = 5 - While you could argue a 3 because he is surly and bitter, he comes across as alone even when surrounded by people, so Loners are Freaks it is.
Contentedness = 5 - The guy is one big ball of angst, angst, angst...
Morality of the Story = 4 - The hero of the story is a douche who gets a bit better and the villain makes you wish someone gave him hug before he decided to attempt genocide, so I'd say the morality is pretty firmly Grey and Gray, even if the ones behind it wish we'd view it as black & white.
Cynicism = 1 - It's a superhero story that isn't a deconstruction of superhero stories, so it's pretty damn idealistic.
Total = 33/9 or 3.7 on the high end (Thor's POV and pretty ice giant). 3 is Who Knows? but 0.7 puts him closer to Likely on the scale of turning traitor. The low end has him as 32/9 or 3.5, which is what most of the other characters would view him as. Honestly, the other characters view him as a traitor much earlier than Thor does, despite having the even less likely possibility from their POV.
As for Loki's redemption potential:
Species = 4 - He's a pretty human-like alien, even when he is blue.
Age = 4 - The whole near-immortal alien equivalent of young adult again.
Role = 1, 2, 4 or 5 - In Thor, Loki is technically both the Big Bad and an opportunist (1 and 2). In the Avengers, it looks like Loki's the Big Bad but by the end, it's pretty obvious he's the Dragon to Thanos (4), at best, with shades of Rival Turned Evil in regards to Thor (5), although perhaps it's more accurate to say Brother Turned Evil.
Aesthetics = 4 - Because Evil is Sexy
Motivation = 2, 3, or 4 - Quite frankly, the reason he's such a fascinating character is because you can make a solid argument for all three. The whole twist plot that culminates with ending the war with the Jotun/Ice Giants by trying to destroy Jotunheim definitely falls under "Unscrupulous with some kind of goal" (2). That he did it the way he did because it would prevent any Aesir from dying makes him a Well-Intentioned Extremist (4). That his motivation for doing it at all was because he wanted to prove to his father he was worthy of being loved just makes him a literal Woobie Destroyer of Worlds (3).
Characterization = 4 or 5, depending on the movie - in Thor, he's definitely a 5. He just learned his whole life up to that point was a lie, so he was definitely lost and confused and the deleted scenes suggest he was making it up as he went. By the end of the Avengers, he's graduated to a Graceful Loser (4).
Contentedness = 5 in Thor, 3 or 4 in the Avengers - Loki's pretty obviously all Angst, angst, angst in Thor. By the Avengers, he seems to have settled somewhere between Life is Hard and Neutral, albeit with the occasional glimpse of Doing Well.
Morality of the Story = 1, 3, or 4 - While the movie makers might claim to be black and white morality (2), the Avengers aren't really all that white on the morality scale. Natasha and Clint have blood on their hands, Bruce admitted to destroying Harlem (and that's not counting anything that happened in The Incredible Hulk), and neither Thor nor Tony Stark come across as particularly moral or anything. Steve Rogers is the closest they have to a righteous man and w/ his PTSD, he'd be the first to argue he's not. They cause damage, kill aliens, and put a metal gag on Loki in the end. W/out Steve's presence, I'd say it was definitely a Black & Gray morality (1). With Steve, it's probably closer to Grey & Gray (3), but with the whole thing with the gag, that's somewhat arguable. You can also make a pretty good argument for 4, aka The Good, the Bad, and the Evil. The Chitauri are obviously the Evil. They don't even bother talking before killing people and destroying things with their army. The Avengers would, ironically, be the Good. Which leaves Loki as the Bad. He's not as bad as the Chitauri. Yeah, he was helping them, but there's indications it wasn't entirely because he wanted to. The scene with him and the Other came across as rather abusive and violent on the Other's part for all that they didn't do much other than talk. Also, Loki's lack of involvement with the Chitauri army he's supposedly leading is somewhat telling. Heck, you can argue Loki was as brainwashed as Clint and Dr. Selvig - he does come across as a lot calmer after the head (and neck and back) injury. Of course if that's the case, we're right back into Black & Gray morality again...
Idealism = 5 - It's a superhero movie. It's pretty damn idealistic.
Total = High end puts him at 40/9 or 4.4 or Quite Probable. Low end puts him at 28/9 or 3.1 or Who Knows? No wonder some many fanfics have him being redeemed in some way.
